AnonymousDecember 15, 2014 at 8:17 PM
Instead
of spending your money on "stuff", have you ever considered going back
to make amends to the people and businesses that were affected when you
declared bankruptcy and didn't pay what you rightfully owed them?
What do you all think? I'd imagine there are lots of different views on this, though I doubt many who have gone through a bankruptcy would feel too much differently then me. Do I spend the next 16 years, until I (hopefully get to) retire, trying to pay off two large pieces of construction equipment (one that originally cost over $200k and another that was almost $200k) that were discharged in our bankruptcy?
I guess this would be my response to Anonymous:
If we are supposed to go back and pay then I'm not sure what the point of going through filing and being discharged in bankruptcy was. My understanding and view is that it is a fresh start in life. Did we want DH to get sick and the economy crash at the same time and lose his business and half our income? Nope. But I also know that the 2 finance companies were able to recoup quite a bit of the money by selling the equipment they repossessed. Both companies repossessed equipment that even though 4-7 years old, was in like new condition, due to how my DH cares for "stuff" and they did get top dollar for them.
We don't smoke, drink, go out or take vacations. We stay home and hang out with our two dogs and try to keep our 26 year old manufactured home from falling apart. I'm sorry that our purchase of "stuff" offends you, but in my finances it is a good investment of my money. $1500 for something that will be worth $2500-$3000 once DH puts some time into it. That's a much better return on my money than what it's getting sitting in savings or than I've gotten on my 401k. It's something we will own and have equity in...and spending $1500 a year for an asset and DH to have some hobby fun is ok in my book.
Between my 2 bonus's I grossed $8250 and spending 18% of that money on an asset that will be worth more than we spent and hold it's value isn't too dumb of decision. A dumb decision would have been to go blow $1500 on clothes and tv's and a vacation, where we would have had nothing for the money. We are staying out of debt and paying cash for our purchases (other than the few things I have charged to no interest promotions, in order to try and rebuild our credit ratings) and hopefully by the time I have to retire we will be able to support ourselves and not be a burden on society.
The past is in the past, move on :)
ReplyDeleteI went into Ch7 Bankruptcy when a guy kept lying in court and winning. The third time he won, I filed for bankruptcy and reaffirmed all my debt in the courtroom except for his debt. He was going to attach a lien to my home, so I moved quickly. No one lost a dime, even the cheater. Oh, tire store did not show up. .
ReplyDeleteThe second time I filed for Ch 11 bankruptcy. I was able to put my house and car in the plan. Both were due to be paid off in two years. It took five instead. I think the car finance place lost $2K. No one else was out anything from my health problem.
After the CH 7, I walked into the tire store and paid him $700 in cash. He was shocked because legally I was off the hook because he was the only person who did not send a lawyer. The three lawyers were from Sears, my mortgage company, and one other place. I don't run up debt I cannot pay then or now.
I just would not call a gun an investment. But, that is your view, so it does not have to agree with my view.
I think if you called up a large company and told them you wanted to pay on an outstanding balance they don't even have on their accounts anymore, they wouldn't know what to do with you. I don't know much about bankruptcy and although I feel it's an easy out for some people that run up debt through poor choices and excessive spending habits, it doesn't sound like that was your case. It was a new start just like you said.
ReplyDeleteI don't like when people feel entitled to buy stuff just because they work but if you are able to afford it without incurring debt and your other bills are paid then go for it. Who am I to judge?
"We are staying out of debt and paying cash for our purchases.."
ReplyDeleteI think this is all you really "owe" after your bankruptcy. You seem to be very responsible with your money.
K-in massachusetts
I wouldn't focus on paying back previous creditors that were discharged in the bankruptcy. I would pay extra on your mortgage though. You've mentioned that you are underwater on your house several times so I would pay that down so you have options.
ReplyDeleteI only think that a gun is an investment if you plan to sell it. My wedding ring appreciates in value but isn't an investment because it will never be sold. That said, I don't see anything wrong with your DH having hobbies like the guns.
You have to be really careful about trying to pay back a creditor once the debt has been discharged. You may end up having to reaffirm all of the debt that was discharged including possible interest.
ReplyDeleteYou are doing what the Court and the rest of the country expects you to do - staying out of debt and learning from your previous mistakes.
If you want talk about payments to society, remind Anonymous you are living by a drug house.
Hey how is the water well issue going?
Regarding your husband's gun hobby ... my concern is that you have, in the past, spoken of his state of mind which alternates between depression and fits of rage. Not someone I think should be around guns at all.
ReplyDeleteAnd ... although you have openly admitted your husband's financial irresponsibility in the past (and present, too), once anybody brings it up you switch into a defensive mode justifying every action, which only enables the irresponsibility to continue.
Anonymous why are you being so hard on someone who is exposing the good and bad of her finances? First off, they have had guns for some time and he has asked for a gun vault so he probably is a little more responsible than you think or possibly believe. Second, please also note that the vast majority of the bonus went into savings not free spending.
ReplyDeleteYour trailer is falling apart and your spending $1500 on a gun? Your behind on your mortgage any your spending $1500 on a gun? That might increase in value maybe in two years for $2500-$3000 once and if DH puts time in it? So, it's worthless now until he puts work in to it?
ReplyDeleteI think you should buy the gun and then be careful not to blow your brains out.
The word "idiots' comes into my mind right about now.
I'm kind of with the other Anon. Your husband's manic depressive state, the drug infested neighbors and your husband's tendency to stalk them (listening to the scanner all night and calling them in everyday) do NOT sound like a good combination. I would rethink getting another gun and get rid of any guns you have.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the points of views. I'm sure if I hadn't brought up that it was a gun that was being purchased, but said something like DH bought another painting to add to his art collection, I wouldn't have gotten any backlash :-)
ReplyDelete@HS - I agree and that's what we are trying to do :-)
@Practical Parsimony - investment is probably a poor choice of words, but I do consider it a purchase of an asset that has value that holds.
@K in Mass - thank you :-)
@ND Chic - Good point! that is something I am working on and actually had planned to post about that soon. The gun could certainly be sold at any time, so neither of us look at it as something like a wedding ring.
@M Ripples - I think you are probably right! A big finance company would probably not know what to do. I have always been of the mindset, though, that a person has a right to do whatever they want with the money they earn and have a right to buy stuff if they want with their money. I have always seen what other employees of companies I have worked for do not what owners spend - Like the owners of the company I work for. They work hard and make in the high six figures - if they want luxury cars, big fancy houses, etc, that is their right.
@Shelly - I have heard that before too, that you have to be careful on reaffirming debt. The water well is doing great! New pump was installed and the pressure is now great. Once I got the county guy involved it was replaced within 2 weeks. And yes, we have had guns for awhile and while they are not my "thing" I do feel much much safer with what is going on in our neighborhood and glad that DH has gone for some extra gun handling and self defense training to learn even more.
@Anon#1 - I didn't ask about the guns. I asked about opinions on whether a person is still responsible to pay off debt discharged in bankruptcy. If you want to address that, I'll be happy to listen.
@Anon#2 - I'll address your comment about our home, since I brought it up. I didn't say our trailer is falling apart. I said we spend some of our income each month/year keeping it from falling apart. If we had to spend that same money we have spent on our home to keep paying off debt that has been dischaged, we would have a house that is falling apart. It is 26 years old. I also did not say we were behind on our mortgage. We have never ever in 30 years been behind on our mortgage. We are currently still some underwater in the value compared to our mortgage balance. Time will fix that issue. I think I'll pass on your suggestion to blow my brains out, but thanks anyway.
Interesting conversation...as long as the bills are paid, food on the table, and there's income in the savings, then it's fair to put your "extra" income where you want it. I don't think I would go back and repay an old debt if it was discharged in a bankruptcy. I would put it towards a personal/family goal.
ReplyDeleteI think you are very brave in even posting all of this information.
ReplyDeleteI assume anonymous is an adult so I can't understand how they would even suggest such a thing. With all the bad in the world, can't we just think before we write nasty comments. So many bloggers have stopped blogging because of stupid comments like the one above, stop reading if you can't at least be nice. Cheryl
ReplyDeleteAs an Anon who has read your blog for quite a while, though you are definitely more of a spender than I am (I have a freshman in college and one about to go to college next year -so all my spare nickles are being saved for that), I think you are not at all frivolous, careless or thoughtless with your budget. Most of the money you spend is to improve your home and yard and to give your husband a daily purpose. And considering his issues you've described, I think it is admirable. My concern is that you have mentioned how you might not be with him once the kids are completely gone, and so with that in mind I'm not sure that investment is worth it in the long run unless you plan to stay with him.
ReplyDeletehmmm. I don't ever recall writing that I might not be with him once the kids are gone (I know Family of Four Debt Blog has written that recently). He is disabled and no way to support himself financially. I would not, could not, morally ever do that to him. Yes, at times he drives me batty, but we've been married almost 30 years. What's a few more, eh? :-)
DeleteYes, the past few years we have spent to repair and upgrade our home and property. After 20+ years of neglect it has very much needed it.
Great answer! Congrats on your 30 years. So many people bail when the sickness(in sickness and in health)part shows up. I applaud you!
DeleteAre the gun(s) purchased and registered in your name or your husband's name?
ReplyDeleteWhat is the point of that question? I don't mind answering it - just truly baffled what difference it makes whatsoever.
ReplyDeleteSo what's the answer then?
ReplyDeleteIt worries me that you dont have a big amounton savings. You are a one income home why not save a good 3 months worth of income just in case you happen to loose one of your jobs. Unfortunatly everyone is replasable and you arent getting any younger and its a sad thing to come to terms when it comes to finding a new job after being let go. I would think havinh a big savings for your husband and yourself is the best investment.
ReplyDeleteThat is something I plan to include in a New Years post about the coming years finances. I currently do have a little over $5,000 in savings and if I were to lose my job, I have $5,000 in unused vacation banked (after taxes would be taken out) that I don't touch. I just leave that in there and most of the time I have more hours accrued than that, even. That would be paid out to me, if I quit, got fired or laid off, so at this point I would have at least $10,000, if I lost my job.
DeleteYou answered this with such grace and tact. I would have asked anonymous if they knew what auto correct was.
DeleteThank you for your kind comments Theresa! They were nice to wake up to and read sitting here with my morning cup of coffee, especially as I am feeling blue over our disappearing act son :(
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